Blackbyrd ([info]blackbyrd2) wrote,
@ 2008-05-10 05:57:00
Previous Entry  Add to memories!  Tell a Friend!  Next Entry
Thanks to (who else?) [info]ajollypyruvate for the link. She's got another one on whooping cough.

Measles outbreak in San Diego in January-February, 2008

Note that of the initial eleven secondary infections, 3 were infants too young to be vaccinated who were infected at the pediatrician's office. That's better than 25% who were exposed and infected for no good reason, whose parents had no choice about protection, all because someone's religious beliefs told them not to take normal, sane protective measures for their children. These people likely don't associate with the source family and would have no way of knowing that such a risk existed, especially in this day and age when vaccinations have all but eliminated diseases like this from our society.

Generally, the socially accepted guideline for liberty/rights is if it doesn't adversely impact others, you should be free to do as you see fit.

OK, so when your kid kills a kid and/or sends dozens or hundreds more to the hospital because you believe God doesn't want you to get vaccinations, I'm pretty sure that's what we'd call adversely impacting others.

Here's my proposal. You don't want your child vaccinated? Fine. You keep him/her (and you) out of public places, (stores, buses, airplanes, malls, McDonalds, doctor's offices, everywhere. Get the picture?) provide home schooling with an approved curriculum and periodic testing by the state, and inform the child by the age of 18 of exactly what's being withheld with appropriate documentation which shows the benefits to be received from vaccinations, and explain that until they get vaccinations, they, like you, get to live in isolation. No jobs where they work with others, no access to public buildings, not even church, unless said church is approved for this type of belief system.

You think I'm being harsh? Hey, just hook up with the rest of your friends that believe the same way. According to that article, 9.6% of the children at that school had PBEs filed. Y'all just hang out together, spread diptheria, whooping cough, measles, rubella, all that stuff amongst yourselves. In a decade or so this won't be a concern to the rest of us.


(Post a new comment)


[info]serrana
2008-05-10 08:18 pm UTC (link)
In all honesty, most vaccine-avoiders -- at least around here -- aren't actually religious. They're medicine-fearing left-wingers.

Part of the reason I pulled Herself out of the preschool she was attending was because I went in one day and the bulletin by the front door was entirely covered in articles about how bad vaccines are. And then all the parents got lectured by one of the teachers about it.

Er. Yeah. No, I don't think y'all are my kind of people.

(Reply to this)(Thread)


[info]blackbyrd2
2008-05-10 09:41 pm UTC (link)
Well, in theory the reason they're exempt is "Personal Belief Exemptions" or PBEs. 9.6% of the student at that school had PBEs on file.
Whether they actually believe, or they simply use the 'religious belief system' as an easy excuse, the rest of the rant stands. You think years of research, results, and the disappearance of small pox and near eradication of other diseases are made up lies that the government tells so they can slip you mind control drugs (or that vaccines are more dangerous than the diseases they protect against)? That's just fine. You can still go live with the rest of the people who insist on putting everybody else in danger because of their beliefs (religious or not.)

(And yes, that's the rhetorical you, not you.) :)

Seriously, I have zero tolerance for these people. The earful I would have given that family... ooo..

Edited at 2008-05-10 09:44 pm UTC

(Reply to this)(Parent)


[info]enjae
2008-05-10 09:24 pm UTC (link)
Ditto that medicine-fearing left-wingers faction. I don't know anyone who hasn't had their kid(s) vaccinated because of religious beliefs. But I do know of a few who believe that vaccines can cause autism and other things, and that the govt. is Covering That Up for the Greater Good. (Not me, for the record. Our kids are vaccinated.)

(Reply to this)(Thread)


[info]blackbyrd2
2008-05-10 09:47 pm UTC (link)
I do know that there is a small group of Christian Scientists that routinely endanger their families because of their religion, but yeah. See above. ;)

(Reply to this)(Parent)


[info]enjae
2008-05-12 04:09 pm UTC (link)
I read this: http://www.startribune.com/lifestyle/health/18843124.html; it made me think of your post again. Like I said before, our kids are vaccinated. This is a no-brainer, non-issue for me. And yet...gosh, our government would never lie or deny or suppress certain facts, would it? I mean, they're always looking out for the good of the all the people, right? They wouldn't hide information and keep their citizens from making truly informed choices, now would they?? (Helloooooo, Tuskegee!)

Some of my earliest memories are of watching Watergate stuffs on the idiot box, and listening to grown-ups Talking Seriously of Government Lies and Cover-Ups. None of it made sense at the time. But I think that and other incidents definitely influenced how I as an adult look at any government. I'm not living in a house covered with tinfoil, but I tend not to take any govt. reassurances or statements at face value.

There are a lot of factors that could be contributing to this supposed rise in autism (improved evaluation techniques comes immediately to mind). I'm not saying it's just the vaccines. But I also wouldn't be surprised if it's someday revealed that the vaccines do have something to do with it, and our govt. either ignored or outright suppressed that info for the sake of the greater good, i.e. better to have a few autistic kids than widespread outbreaks of MMR.

I guess this is a long-winded way of saying that I can actually understand where some of these parents are coming from.

(Reply to this)(Thread)


[info]blackbyrd2
2008-05-12 08:11 pm UTC (link)
While I'll grant that the government generally does a poor job of taking care of the people, the issue here isn't whether vacines are bad, but whether the way they are prepared is bad. The culprit in the article is a preservative which is mercury based. You'd think such a thing would be a no-brainer, but being as it is Big Pharma who makes the vaccines, the problem lies with both the FDA, and with the influence of money on government agencies.

I've been ranting about the government for a number of years, but there's a few things I have come to accept. One is that our government is too incompetent to operate an actual conspiracy, and incapable of keeping anything of importance a secret. What they are prone to is looking the other way in exchange for money, and allowing corporate influence to decide public policy.

I would bet dollars to donuts though, that 95% of those who choose the PBEs have no factual basis for doing so, and are relying entirely on hearsay or a 'feeling' that the government's vaccination policy is 'bad'. There is likely more data on cell phones causing cancer or teflon causing either tumors or lung disease than there is on vaccines being dangerous. (Not to ignore the actual stats on bad reactions to vaccines, but when viewed in relation to the potential lives being saved, it's like deciding to walk everywhere because driving is deadly. Actually, driving is significantly more dangerous than vaccines.)

(Reply to this)(Parent)


[info]blackbyrd2
2008-05-13 04:30 pm UTC (link)
Interesting link in reference to the article you posted.
Phil's site is one I visit a few times a year, but generally for the entertainment value vs the movies I enjoy.
This link came via [info]ajollypyruvate who provided the first link above. She's getting a masters (or doctorate?) in epidemiology, so she has a certain interest in things plague-related.

I don't claim a whole lot of knowledge, as evidenced by the above link. (Otherwise I'd have debunked on the spot.) Mercury based preservatives sure sounded like something stupid done by Big Pharma in the interest of saving money. Which proves both our points, I suppose;
Yours that people might understandably be concerned about vaccines based entirely on the available data in the mainstream media, (after all, I bought into it based simply on a news story) and mine that the people making the decisions are not making well-informed decisions. (Or they'd know these studies show no link between thimerosol and autism, for instance.)

Such data should be checked thoroughly, and decisions should not be made based on hearsay.
Now, apparently there's been a huge blowup by anti-vaccinationists over there, so I'm going to go see if there's any new info. :) Learning is always good.

Edited at 2008-05-13 04:31 pm UTC

(Reply to this)(Parent)


Create an Account
Forgot your login?
Login w/ OpenID
English • Español • Deutsch • Русский…